Sep
5
5
Confession
Filed under: Asides | Tags: Firefox (2), browsers, ie7 | September 5th, 2007
I’ve been using IE7 quite a bit lately. It’s a darn-good browser and seems very fast, especially when I have a lot of tabs open, compared to Firefox. (141)
Michael | September 5th, 2007 @ 3:43 am | Reply
How much did Microsoft pay you to say that? :/
Ben | September 5th, 2007 @ 3:47 am | Reply
Have you tried Opera 9.5 Alpha 1?
Ben
David | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:03 am | Reply
Yes, perhaps so Matt, but have you noticed how much “crap” gets left behind in the “system” even after the most briefest of use? If novices (the majority of Net users) don’t do a “clean” after each use, its fortunate there are such large hard-drives on the market, otherwise they’d be wondering where the disk space is going!
Baris Unver | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:04 am | Reply
No it’s not. I don’t care. Firefox rules!
Matt Doran | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:10 am | Reply
I find the opposite. I find that IE7 feels sluggish after using Firefox.
It’s hard to put my finger on … it’s a number of thing. It seems to take longer to open new tabs. I also find the behaviour when loading new pages a bit ugly. Often the page goes completely blank/white before the new page is rendering. I never see that on Firefox.
TDH | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:13 am | Reply
It’s pretty good, but I really dislike the milliseconds more it takes for it to open a new tab. Faster with lots of tabs, yes, perhaps, but overall I find it a bit sluggish.
But maybe I should give it a shot… No wait! I’m on Mac!
Paolo/Pixline | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:13 am | Reply
You can let Safari for Windows do a test spin, while you’re experimenting.. If it’s half the speed it has on mac, I think you’ll be satisfied, but I haven’t a windows system to try it so I can’t say it for sure
Toxic | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:17 am | Reply
Welcome to the dark side.
GaMerZ | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:18 am | Reply
Firefox 2.0 seems to be less stable than Firefox 1.x as it crash more often =(
Chris Harrison | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:30 am | Reply
It’s nothing to be ashamed of. I’ve found it hard to tear myself away from Firefox to give it a shot, but it can’t be *that* bad.
stadi | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:33 am | Reply
Try Maxthon! The classic 1.6 version or the new 2. It is even more customizable then Firefox without the need for plugins or addons and it uses the IE engine.
One of the reasons I don’t use IE7 is that even with IE7 I cant customize the tab behavior the way I can it in Firefox with Tab Mix Plus. Of course in Maxthon this is a built in feature.
n-blue | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:35 am | Reply
IE7 is my defualt browser, I mainly using it since beta 1. But still some negative points. Some certain web sites will lead IE7 to the death, or non-respond, or close itself.
To specify with WP, if blog owner with WP 2.1&2.2 placed a number of javascript (especially within BODY)IE7 will frsutrating you. You know what I mean.
matt | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:37 am | Reply
for shaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaame! (tsk tsk tsk)
I’m just kidding - to each their own. Firefox seems a little weird at times, but I’ve had a lot less worries from it than with IE.
LiewCF | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:40 am | Reply
As a Mac user, I haven’t really try IE7 yet. The safari 3 beta and Opera 9.5 beta are fast browsers too. Firefox 3 (currently in Alpha stage) is faster than Firefox 2. The browsers war still continue.
James | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:46 am | Reply
It’s a shame the interface is so bad. I ran it with Maxthon on top for a good number of my FireFox features (Super Drag and Go) with a lot of positive feedback.
Jack @ The Tech Teapot | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:56 am | Reply
I had you down as a Linux or Apple kindofa guy, you know, cos of the open source thingy. Unless you’re being ironic of course. Darn, I never pick up on the ironic posts.
Viper007Bond | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:58 am | Reply
Tsk tsk. *sigh*
While a huge improvement over IE6, it still can render horribly and has countless rendering bugs. Not to mention it’s still insecure as hell.
Plus, the biggest reason to use Firefox is extensions. I couldn’t live without all the Firefox addons I have installed.
Ricardo | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:11 am | Reply
Just try Opera. It’s even faster.
Bob | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:17 am | Reply
Opera faster than IE7. really
farlane | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:21 am | Reply
Say 23 Hail Mozillas my son.
I wish there was an alternative sometimes for the mac … and also that IE wasn’t such a darn cowboy when it when it comes to standards.
Jan Stedehouder | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:24 am | Reply
I have recently begun using Seamonkey for exactly the same reason. FF is getting sluggish.
Asbjørn Ulsberg | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:26 am | Reply
People are different I suppose, but my experience is that IE7 is way slower than IE6 which again is way slower than Firefox which again is way slower than Opera. Just opening a tab takes well over a second on all setups of IE7 I’ve seen, including an AMD AM2-64 5000+ with 2GB RAM and Windows Vista. What setup are you using where IE7 manages to outperform Firefox? It sounds quite impossible to me, at least based on my experience.
Fawaz | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:27 am | Reply
there is a remarkable difference between firefox and IE7. Sure of late I’ve noticed that Firefox is getting quite a bit bloated especially with all those plugins “plugged in”.
Even then, I believe firefox is much faster in comparison to IE7. The way a page is rendered in Firefox it is much faster than IE7.
I still love Firefox. It rocks. But then we all have our choices. I think you should consider changing the purpose of the BrowseHappy.com to encourage people to shift back to IE7
futurix | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:35 am | Reply
Does this mean that WordPress admin area will be fixed to look nicer in IE7?
Chris Thomson | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:40 am | Reply
Most of the time when I’m on a PC, I use IE7 too, Firefox is not my favorite browser on any platform. I’m not on the PC too often, so I don’t have to use Windows’ browsers much
Shahab | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:44 am | Reply
If you are trying IE7, then you should really try Maxthon. It will add hell lotta features to IE that you might be missing from Firefox.
Rajiv | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:46 am | Reply
IE7 is leaps and bounds better than any previous Microsoft browsers. It’s pretty good, I use it too quite often but Firefox has taken over my life (and computer too).
Carson | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:48 am | Reply
I’m glad to know that I’m not the only techie (half-assed in my case) that thinks IE7 might serve my needs better than Firefox. One problem I have with Firefox is the way it displays fonts. They are all too thin for my tired old eyes. (That might be fixable but, like I said, I’m just a half-assed techie.
Martin | September 5th, 2007 @ 5:53 am | Reply
Hi Matt
Are you serious? I can’t say I have used IE7 extensively, but I still hate it because it’s IE and it still has problems handling CSS properly (what I have seen so far).
Maybe you should try deinstalling some unused firefox plug-ins which would speed up things a little in firefox?
rr-designpraxis | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:00 am | Reply
I’ll stick to Firefox just ’cause I love Open Source. Let’s do our best to make it as speedy as IE7!
Sam | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:00 am | Reply
Oh boy!
but let’s not start flame wars
oh no | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:01 am | Reply
Oh NO! … try Opera
Sam | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:02 am | Reply
And by the way: I reluctantly use IE7 every day - because Microsoft didn’t (couldn’t) make SharePoint 2007 100% compatible with other browsers (some functionality missing).
Kirk M | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:07 am | Reply
Not to worry. I doubt you’ll be ostracized…much.
The fact is that IE is a good browser and since it’s part of the OS itself it tends to use up a heck of a lot less resources hence the overall speed is greater. It definitely does not work well on certain sites like when using the Admin side of a WordPress install though, especially the editor. IE is good for general browsing. Firefox is good for turning into any sort of specific “tool” box that you might need. Like the ultimate blogging tool for instance. The biggest problem with most folks is that it’s either one or the other when you can get a much better experience by using both.
Darren Brierton | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:10 am | Reply
Huh. And I thought you were a Mac user. But IE7 may be fast, but I wouldn’t call it a “darn-good” browser. I still have loads of issues getting my CSS to work properly in it. See this:
http://www.designdetector.com/2006/08/ie7-old-bugs-for-new.php
Phil Wiffen | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:13 am | Reply
Matt, I was thinking this the other day. I’ve been using Firefox since 0.7 but its memory and CPU usage, with many tabs open, is starting to grind me down.
I know a few of my friends have switched back to IE recently. Maybe it’s time I gave IE another chance!
Pingback: Kapusta Brothers » Blog Archive » IE-7 Dark Side
Nick | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:16 am | Reply
I, in fact, have the exact opposite experience as far as responsiveness goes. For me, it takes IE7 at least a couple of seconds to open a new tab. Firefox does it almost instantaneously. Then, when I want to close the browser, it takes at least 4 seconds to close multiple tabs in IE and shut down whereas Firefox usually exits after less than 1 second.
I also find with IE that I miss a lot of the functionality provided by the myriad plugins that I have installed in Firefox.
That being said, I definitely think IE7 is a huge upgrade from IE6 and I use it from time to time. I don’t avoid it like the plague like I did with IE6.
Gerry Tucker | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:19 am | Reply
In terms of website design, obviously I have to test on as many different browsers as possible, so I tend to start with FF as a base browser, but as a user I want a browser that is easy to use and quick. Which is why IE7 is my browser of choice.
I’m not a great lover of the mouse, so being able to use consistent keyboard shortcuts across applications, i.e. browser, Office etc is a usability plus for me.
Opera just doesn’t operate in a “Windows” way, and as for Safari, well I don’t know why Apple didn’t just put a banner advertisement on it saying “designed to p*** Windows users off!!”.
Give me IE7 everyday.
Jim | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:22 am | Reply
It’s ok - I was just commenting the other day on how Firefox seems to get bigger with each new version or update. It’s become a bit of a beast lately. I’ve started using Safari for Windows a bit more lately.
Rémi Prévost | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:27 am | Reply
IE7 might be good, but its rendering engine doesn’t beat Gecko for sure — that’s why I love Firefox.
Emz | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:29 am | Reply
Do you know how much beating you’ve let yourself in for?
*kidding*
I haven’t found IE7 to be fast at all on my computer (rather the opposite) so am still sticking to my Firefox guns!
True, Firefox tends to get a little shaky with more than, say, 6 tabs open, but I find just one takes forever to load in IE7.
Although, to be fair, that could just be my arrogant computer.
grasland | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:30 am | Reply
Haha, a daring confession! But it is fast indeed. Especially starting up the app is much faster. I still like FF better for its extensions etc.
scott bakalar | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:33 am | Reply
shhh…
me too…
Liquid Egg Product | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:37 am | Reply
Heretic.
Although I primarily use Opera, so I never considered you part of “the faith” anyway.
katy lavallee | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:40 am | Reply
I’m on a Mac and had to switch over to Safari. I really love Firefox and am sad to leave it, but it’s ridiculous how slow it is. I do have a lot of extensions, but as a developer I need most of them. Now, I only open it up for debugging. Sad, really sad.
nathan | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:42 am | Reply
Have you tried Safari? It’s even faster.
Very interesting to hear your confession.
I have had a hard time switching to Safari from Firefox though. I guess I just like it the way I’m used to it.
Daniel | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:49 am | Reply
That’s okay, Matt. I admit that I’m still using IE 6 as my primary browser!
Something about Firefox isn’t quite comfortable for me. I tried IE 7 when it was first released, and it had a ton of bugs — plus the interface threw me off. I’m still gunshy about updating to it.
But, it’s looking clear that IE 7 will be a necessity to test performance and validity on every site moving forward, so eventually I’ll have to install it.
Amy | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:53 am | Reply
Don’t forget how much nicer the fonts look.
Radioactive Jam | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:55 am | Reply
I felt a great disturbance in the Force, as if millions of lines of code suddenly cried out in terror, and were suddenly silenced.
Jeremy | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:58 am | Reply
Page rendering and scrolling is quite slow, but tabbing is very snappy.
I also like the behaviour of opening new tabs. If you’re, say, on the left-most tab when you have several tabs open, and you middle-click on a link, the new tab will appear to the right of the tab you’re currently in. Then, if immediately after, you middle-click another link, the new tab will appear to the right of the tab that was just opened in the background.
Recently, I discovered I don’t have to use IE7 to get that, as Epiphany has that exact tab behaviour as well. (Plus, Epiphany is damn fast compared to Firefox or IE7, even with a load of extensions installed.)
Pupung Budi Purnama | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:03 am | Reply
I’m Prefer The World Browser to “Pure” IE7
Andrew @ TFTS | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:08 am | Reply
The shame of it! lol.
Actually, I’m finding the latest release of Firfox gets bogged down so very easily with multi tabbed browsing that IE has begun to creep into my mind.
I’m going to stand in the corner now…(can I join you).
jeremy | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:10 am | Reply
But it won’t block ads. I’ll stick with firefox.
P.G.Taboada | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:13 am | Reply
Redmond knows how to make good looking software. It is the security I am concerned with. IE is just to deep in the system. I think it is called inappropriate Intimacy (software bad smell, refactoring book)
Andrew | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:18 am | Reply
How can one of the Kings of Open-Source fall into the hands of using Closed-Source applications???
Jonathan Dingman | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:23 am | Reply
Looks like I need to gather the crew because you’re going to be hanged for it.
Matt, how DARE YOU! TRAITOR!!!!
sam | September 5th, 2007 @ 7:43 am | Reply
woah! what a shocker. i’m using a mac and i’ve been finding firefox slow - slower thank safari.
m@ | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:03 am | Reply
What will the open source community think of you?! Yeah, it’s a fast browser, but it’s ugly as hell.
Kanwal | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:05 am | Reply
I definitely agree with you. The only thing that keeps me from making it my default browser is all the extensions… if there was some way to have those extensions on IE7, firefox would be history on my pc
adam | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:13 am | Reply
everything is fast with multiple tabs, compared to firefox. if safari weren’t otherwise buggy, it’s lightning quick on windoze.
Matteo Campofiorito | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:23 am | Reply
Comparing IE7 with Firefox is like comparing a single application with an operating system.
IE7 could be also faster than Firefox but there is no match regarding the flexibility and the add-ons in the open source browser.
Heliologue | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:24 am | Reply
If you aren’t wedded to Firefox’s extensions, why not simply use Opera? If speed’s your thing, it’s hella faster even than IE7, and it hasn’t got the b0rked rendering.
huphtur | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:28 am | Reply
Traitor!
Zacharias | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:28 am | Reply
if you aren’t the use-a-thousand-extentions person (like me), IE7 is just as good, performance-wise (it seems like FF takes 90-100megs o’ ram whenever I look)
arentcha worried about security, though?
Benedikt | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:38 am | Reply
Really? I never got used to it — opening a new tab just takes too long in IE7.
Johan | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:53 am | Reply
It is definitely fast, but I just can’t live without my firefox add ins!
c. Wess Daniels | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:06 am | Reply
It takes a big man to say something like that Matt, thank you.
Anders | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:07 am | Reply
I’m using mostly FireFox, but maybe I should go back and try IE for a while?
On a local download speed test (http://kuivuri.pp.htv.fi/speed/) I’ve noticed that IE consistently achieves more than double the download rates of Firefox… what’s up with that?
Silveira Neto | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:08 am | Reply
I have a confession too.
Sometimes I use IE too. I emulate it in Linux to check some of my websites
Walker | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:22 am | Reply
Glad to know that you’re not stubborn and a person who telling truth.
In fact, Firefox vs IE7 vs Opera vs Safari vs ETC…there will no absolute answer which is the best!
To me, Linux or Vista is up to what tasks I’m doing with.
It’s really antipathetic to hear someone insist saying only Windows or Linux is the best. So as Wordpress and Blogger.
Television Blog | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:24 am | Reply
i like IE7 much better than firefox too..
Joshua | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:26 am | Reply
I’ve actually been in a lot of situations recently where I’ve been without my thumb drive, see forgotten, and IE7 has actually come in handy. Not the most secure, but I find it good for the few minutes I need to use it every day.
Eric | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:40 am | Reply
What?! NO!…no no no….j/k.
I also been using IE7, but only to verify designs and articles aren’t showing up all funky. Have you noticed any issues with CSS display?
Kartik Mistry | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:54 am | Reply
You should open too many tabs with Firefox and try..
Patrick Havens | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:54 am | Reply
I’ll admit to only using it on my Vista laptop…. and that’s because of the firefox issues under Vista*. It does have better memory management and is snappy. I kept running into weirdness rendering bugs and mainly the “oh… that’s flash” issue.
They have done a pretty decent job, but I still find that popups are an issue (without google toolbar) and I’ve come across more then one exploit. Mainly the exploits I’ve found where aimed at auto-installing a “browser helper.”
* Which may of been fixed by now, but I’ve been afraid to try. Took a bit to fix last time I did try.
BoltClock | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:14 am | Reply
Firefox is just slightly bloated.
You should try Opera and compare the two browsers’ speeds. I’ve been using it for a couple months now and I’ve had a great time using it since Fx has been eating my memory lately. I still use Fx for development and testing.
I can’t get IE7, the stupid WGA is barring me from accessing it.
But it’s alright, 7 is my lucky number after all
David | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:38 am | Reply
A pox upon you Mr High-Profile Traitor
Seriously, I have lots of reasons to prefer Firefox over IE, but I don’t see why my preference (or anyone elses) must be The One Right View (TM)
Mark Jaquith | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:48 am | Reply
First of all: perhaps you’ve heard of this web site.
Second, I’ve been looking for Firefox alternatives too. It’s just too damn slow. I use Safari for all my primary browsing, and only switch into Firefox for web development.
Sourabh | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:51 am | Reply
I agree with Matt. Off late, firefox has been giving me a lot of problems too.
Check my rants here: Something seriously wrong with Firefox
Pedro Sostre | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:52 am | Reply
Matt,
It makes me so happy to hear you say this. Look over your comments. Many of them are from people upset that IE renders poorly/doesnt handle their CSS properly. Most end users dont even know what that means.
As a developer, I love FF. The extensions alone make it worthwhile. As an entrepreneur serving end users, you have to go to where they are- and they’re on IE.
With that said, the latest WP admin area still doesn’t work properly in IE. I always have to make my writers download and install FF to update our blogs- very frustrating. I hope you’ll consider adding a little cross-browser love
Robert Synnott | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:56 am | Reply
But the big question is, what does this mean for BrowseHappy?
Matt | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:57 am | Reply
Wow! That’s a lot of comments.
I don’t really it to use it for the same things I use Firefox for, it’s more for things that don’t require a login or browsing.
For example I was checking out apartments on Craigslist yesterday and used IE7, but when I had narrowed down the 3-4 I want to follow up on I bookmarked them in Firefox.
Chad | September 5th, 2007 @ 10:59 am | Reply
The only feature that keeps me from using IE 7 is the bookmarks toolbar. It’s just about useless since I can’t create folders on the fly and nothing seems to stay sorted in the order I want it to … otherwise, it’s a great browser.
btard | September 5th, 2007 @ 11:02 am | Reply
fact is, that firefox leaks memory like a drunken baby’s diaper.
Chris | September 5th, 2007 @ 11:36 am | Reply
I find it comedy to read how many people who have probably never used IE7 shouting about how much “better” firefox is! The number of pirated Windows XP installs out there suggest that not everyone on this page has a IE7 installed…
I respect the fact you’re willing to admit you don’t mind using it. A number of the “open source crowd” rubbished it before it was even released and wouldnt even give it the time of day - then have the balls to bad mouth it. Bias? lol.
Personally, I’ll use either. I tend towards IE when I’m watching embedded videos, and FF when I’m working on webdesign. Both have good points, both have bad, but I’d struggle to come up with a convincing argument to either being “better” than the other.
Gretchen Cawthon | September 5th, 2007 @ 12:14 pm | Reply
Matt - Firefox can be slow because of memory leaks in some of the extensions. There is a list of some extensions to be aware of - one of which is firebug - which many of us use for web development. I disable it when I am not using it and it made a huge improvement in speed.
David Andersson | September 5th, 2007 @ 12:36 pm | Reply
I am using Firefox in OSX and is actually terribly disappointed. More than five tabs, and if there happens to be more than one flash instance, it crashes.
Anthony | September 5th, 2007 @ 12:40 pm | Reply
*Shock* “Kill the wise one!!” lol
Richard Catto | September 5th, 2007 @ 1:05 pm | Reply
Matt, I use IE7 everyday alongside Firefox 2.0.0.6.
The only reason I use it, though, is to read gmail in my second account.
If Google would allow multiple simultaneous logins in one browser, I could say, “Hasta la Vista!” to IE7!
IE7 does load faster than Firefox though. I think the reason is the plugins I have loaded into FF.
CaminoFan | September 5th, 2007 @ 1:12 pm | Reply
Dear MacUsers don’t forget to use the excellent ‘Camino’ browser, speciallyu design for our needs (and so speedy).
Patrick D'appollonio | September 5th, 2007 @ 1:26 pm | Reply
I think the same than Michael, How much did Microsoft pay you to say that?
Ryan Paul | September 5th, 2007 @ 1:49 pm | Reply
What’s wrong with hating IE7 just because it’s made by Microsoft? There’s no unspoken ethics that say hating Microsoft products is bad or immoral.
Let’s just hate IE7, and IE8, and IE9… because it’s made by microsoft. And of course because of the stupid aliasing on text, and the ugly new interface, and all the other stupid things about it.
Ben K. | September 5th, 2007 @ 2:05 pm | Reply
David: That’s why we have Camino.
Victoria E | September 5th, 2007 @ 2:06 pm | Reply
Blasphemy!
Pingback: Ismael El-Qudsi » Blog Archive » Internet Explorer 7 es un buen navegador
Sarah | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:38 pm | Reply
Bite your tongue!
Eats Wombats | September 5th, 2007 @ 4:40 pm | Reply
My son, I am surprised that you have not yet received penance and forgiveness. The Lord is merciful and you need not chastise yourself if your repentance is genuine and you are resolved to sin no more. Say three Hail Marys, one Our Father and a Glory Be and go in peace. Amen.
n-blue | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:22 pm | Reply
Again, I am big fan of Opera too but still not able to say it faster and fastest.
Try Safari if you want a simple think and thinking of Firefox 0.9. Hey! after using Safari for awhile don’t uninstall it. It will leave a key on Windows Startup items that make your comp extreamely slow down when boot. Otherwise you need to visit msconfig.
Kian Ann | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:33 pm | Reply
WHAAAAT! Well, I gotta admit sometimes I use IE too, because I had to - some sites are just meant for IE.
But still, FF rules.
Dan | September 5th, 2007 @ 6:52 pm | Reply
Actually, the IE7 interface is a bit nifty but you can get 90% of its features in the Firefox IE7 theme.
Because those superficial features are the only thing that’s appealing about IE7, it’s actually terrible on the inside and not at all a high performance competitor to Firefox.
Robert Accettura | September 5th, 2007 @ 8:17 pm | Reply
You’re born to be a politician!
/kidding
GoodThings2Life | September 5th, 2007 @ 9:08 pm |